Talk.Origin Banned Subject: Red Sea Parting Possible By Jennifer Viegas, Discovery News

[jabriol]

so.. you simply don't accept some scientific data.
not the first time.. but let me reply to a few of your

Red Sea Reefs from Space Feb. 2, 2004 ? The parting of the Red Sea...
<SNIP>...I write is clueless about everything I write regardless.

1. Have you ever tried to walk on an exposed coral reef? That stuff is
_very_ sharp and _very_ uneven. Whatsmore, depending on the species,
some of it is very brittle. It wouldn't suppport hundereds of
thousands of people tramping across it.

well, I have walk on coral.. are you saying that the israelite were all
walking barefooted?

2. Exposure to the air and the high winds postulated would have killed
the coral polyps, destroying the reef. As per usual, biology makes a
mockery of biblical apology.

maybe they were destroyed...

3. None of the pyramids, temples or the tombs of ancient Egypt were
built using slave labour. It is not just that there is no evidence of
Jewish slaves in Egypt, but that we have direct and documentary
evidence that the Egyptians did the building themselves.

who said that the hebrew sole job was building pyramids... as I read they
were building many different things.. and there is documents that eyptians
use slave for various things..

4. In all Egyptian history, there is only one mention of Isreal -
during the reign of King Murneptah and he was buried in the Valley of
the Kings; not at the bottom of the Red Sea. I have been in his tomb.

You also forget about how eygptian history is writen and re written. they
had a nasty habit of not writing anything that would embarras them... and
that is documented as well.

5. If the events in Exodus had actually happened as described, it
would have had a devastating affect on ancient Egyptian religion - in
much the same way as gunpowder has done for so many tribal beliefs in
more recent times. Yet the Egyptian pantheon continued to thrive until
very nearly 1600 years after Merneptah's demise.

see my reply above.

[Ian Braidwood]

Post by jabriol
so.. you simply don't accept some scientific data.
not the first time.. but let me reply to a few of your

Red Sea Reefs from Space Feb. 2, 2004 ? The parting of the Red Sea...
<SNIP>...I write is clueless about everything I write regardless.

1. Have you ever tried to walk on an exposed coral reef? That stuff is
_very_ sharp and _very_ uneven. Whatsmore, depending on the species,
some of it is very brittle. It wouldn't suppport hundereds of
thousands of people tramping across it.

well, I have walk on coral.. are you saying that the israelite were all
walking barefooted?

I'm not talking about nice, partially erroded coral, but _fresh_
coral, which is uneven and brittle. You would need an unbroken line of
coral several miles long.

No, I'm not suggesting that the Isrealites went barefoot. However, the
sort of shoes useful for wear in Egyptian towns would not stand up to
that kind of punishment and neither would the coral. Perhaps God
isssued them with modern British Army boots?

Post by jabriol

2. Exposure to the air and the high winds postulated would have killed
the coral polyps, destroying the reef. As per usual, biology makes a
mockery of biblical apology.

maybe they were destroyed...

They wouldn't even last long enough for the crossing. Remember these
are structures grown in water, they'd have to be strong enough to take
the weight of all those people whilst denied the natural support of
bouyancy.

Post by jabriol

3. None of the pyramids, temples or the tombs of ancient Egypt were
built using slave labour. It is not just that there is no evidence of
Jewish slaves in Egypt, but that we have direct and documentary
evidence that the Egyptians did the building themselves.

who said that the hebrew sole job was building pyramids... as I read they
were building many different things.. and there is documents that eyptians
use slave for various things..

Oh yes, Egyptians did use slave labour, but not for sacred work and
there is no evidence of Jewish slaves in Egypt. There should be.

Post by jabriol

4. In all Egyptian history, there is only one mention of Isreal -
during the reign of King Murneptah and he was buried in the Valley of
the Kings; not at the bottom of the Red Sea. I have been in his tomb.

You also forget about how eygptian history is writen and re written. they
had a nasty habit of not writing anything that would embarras them... and
that is documented as well.

How do we know that the Egyptians rewrote history? Because there was
contradictory evidence, which in this case is lacking.

Even if the Egyptians had tried to expunge exodus from their records,
they wouldn't have been able to delete records locked away in the
tombs of their people, including the hypothetical king who first
conquered the Jews. We should have this evidence, but it is missing
from a remarkably complete record. The Egyptians _loved_ to boast
about there conquests, even you can't deny that.

In this case, absence of evidence _is_ evidence of absence.

Post by jabriol

5. If the events in Exodus had actually happened as described, it
would have had a devastating affect on ancient Egyptian religion - in
much the same way as gunpowder has done for so many tribal beliefs in
more recent times. Yet the Egyptian pantheon continued to thrive until
very nearly 1600 years after Merneptah's demise.

see my reply above.

I don't think your reply addresses this question at all. After all,
the collapse of Egyptian religion would have been catastrophic -
within one or two generations at most. Yet Egyptian religion was so
strong that when the Greeks conquered Egypt, they built temples
dedictaed to Egyptian gods like Horus.

Sorry Jabbers, but there is nothing to corroborate Exodus as anything
more than a tale of Isrealite conceit.

(-: Ian :-)

[Marc Levenson]

Could you participants in this thread please remove the other newsgroups that are not interested in what
appears to be a theological conversation? I don't see how rec.aquaria.marine.reefs would be interested.
and have removed it from the addresses addressed above, before sending my reply.

Thanks.

Post by Ian Braidwood

Post by jabriol
so.. you simply don't accept some scientific data.
not the first time.. but let me reply to a few of your

Red Sea Reefs from Space Feb. 2, 2004 ? The parting of the Red Sea...
<SNIP>...I write is clueless about everything I write regardless.

1. Have you ever tried to walk on an exposed coral reef? That stuff is
_very_ sharp and _very_ uneven. Whatsmore, depending on the species,
some of it is very brittle. It wouldn't suppport hundereds of
thousands of people tramping across it.

well, I have walk on coral.. are you saying that the israelite were all
walking barefooted?

I'm not talking about nice, partially erroded coral, but _fresh_
coral, which is uneven and brittle. You would need an unbroken line of
coral several miles long.
No, I'm not suggesting that the Isrealites went barefoot. However, the
sort of shoes useful for wear in Egyptian towns would not stand up to
that kind of punishment and neither would the coral. Perhaps God
isssued them with modern British Army boots?

Post by jabriol

2. Exposure to the air and the high winds postulated would have killed
the coral polyps, destroying the reef. As per usual, biology makes a
mockery of biblical apology.

maybe they were destroyed...

They wouldn't even last long enough for the crossing. Remember these
are structures grown in water, they'd have to be strong enough to take
the weight of all those people whilst denied the natural support of
bouyancy.

Post by jabriol

3. None of the pyramids, temples or the tombs of ancient Egypt were
built using slave labour. It is not just that there is no evidence of
Jewish slaves in Egypt, but that we have direct and documentary
evidence that the Egyptians did the building themselves.

who said that the hebrew sole job was building pyramids... as I read they
were building many different things.. and there is documents that eyptians
use slave for various things..

Oh yes, Egyptians did use slave labour, but not for sacred work and
there is no evidence of Jewish slaves in Egypt. There should be.

Post by jabriol

4. In all Egyptian history, there is only one mention of Isreal -
during the reign of King Murneptah and he was buried in the Valley of
the Kings; not at the bottom of the Red Sea. I have been in his tomb.

You also forget about how eygptian history is writen and re written. they
had a nasty habit of not writing anything that would embarras them... and
that is documented as well.

How do we know that the Egyptians rewrote history? Because there was
contradictory evidence, which in this case is lacking.
Even if the Egyptians had tried to expunge exodus from their records,
they wouldn't have been able to delete records locked away in the
tombs of their people, including the hypothetical king who first
conquered the Jews. We should have this evidence, but it is missing
from a remarkably complete record. The Egyptians _loved_ to boast
about there conquests, even you can't deny that.
In this case, absence of evidence _is_ evidence of absence.

Post by jabriol

5. If the events in Exodus had actually happened as described, it
would have had a devastating affect on ancient Egyptian religion - in
much the same way as gunpowder has done for so many tribal beliefs in
more recent times. Yet the Egyptian pantheon continued to thrive until
very nearly 1600 years after Merneptah's demise.

see my reply above.

I don't think your reply addresses this question at all. After all,
the collapse of Egyptian religion would have been catastrophic -
within one or two generations at most. Yet Egyptian religion was so
strong that when the Greeks conquered Egypt, they built temples
dedictaed to Egyptian gods like Horus.
Sorry Jabbers, but there is nothing to corroborate Exodus as anything
more than a tale of Isrealite conceit.
(-: Ian :-)

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